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origin of characters

Élie   December 18th, 2008 10:32p.m.

Some characters and words are pretty straight forward to understand (eg. 十字路口), but others make it really difficult to remember. I think it can be interesting to have a thread where some characters' etymology and "transformations" are explained.

I would like to know why 长 becomes 镸 in the standing radical form. Does anyone know?

nick   December 18th, 2008 11:08p.m.

This is a good idea. This one I actually know (a little).

长's traditional form is 長, which is pretty close to 镸, right?

Okay, that's it, I guess, all I know.

I need to buy one of those character history books so I can reference the visual evolution of the older forms. Anyone have any recommendations?

I'm also curious if anyone knows what this radical really means:
攴, with alternate (more common form) 攵?
Our list has it as "rap", which isn't that helpful (to rap on a door? To freestyle over some tasty beats?). I just think of it as some sort of hand thing, but it'd be good to know what it really is.

ZachH   December 19th, 2008 6:25a.m.

攴 is a right hand holding an axe, 攵 is the evolved form.

镸 is long hair (彡) tied by a broach. 长 is the simplified form of 镸. Some words avoided simplification, like 时髦.

Also, apparently '卩' no longer means seal and now is someone kneeling.

s2682693 are you working through the radical list? I have finished it and only found it only moderately helpful, the reason is because the pronunciation of many of these radicals are not currently in use.
Its also a list of 'Radicals' not a list of 'Components' - there is a big difference, radicals are what is used to look words up in the dictionary, components are all the parts that make up characters.

If you find learning the etymology helps remember characters I encourage you to buy an expensive dictionary. But it doesn't help me, most of the etymology seems more imagination than logic. I memorize the different parts to write characters but not how they influence the meaning.

Etymology is more interesting/helpful if you are learning traditional characters I have heard.

ZachH   December 19th, 2008 6:34a.m.

Oh, I feel it important to add that learning the Phonetic character components IS very helpful,
and the basic component meanings too, like 贝 representing money, 食 for food.

Élie   December 22nd, 2008 10:00a.m.

Thanks for the help, it does help me to remember 長 ^^. To answer your question Zach, yes I am going through the radicals list right now, I wanted to correct some bad habits I had, especially with stroke order. I find the etymology can sometimes help to remember particularly reticent characters, but I don't use it systematically.

Cheers again !

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